In this episode we talk about how coronavirus is impacting work, how to mentally make the adjustment, to reskill and so much more!
Surabhi Lal is a facilitator, storyteller, speaker, and consultant who is in the business of the future of work for individuals, teams, and organizations. She champions inclusive workplaces and uses empathy and strategy to create cultures where individuals and teams thrive. Over the course of her career, she has coached thousands of job seekers, entrepreneurs, and small businesses to help them achieve meaningful success.
Surabhi is currently the Chief Impact Officer at Luminary, a nationally recognized collaboration hub dedicated to advancing women through community. She is an Adjunct Assistant Professor at NYU’s Robert F. Wagner Graduate School of Public Service where she teaches courses that focus on management, leadership, workplace effectiveness, and career development.
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you're listening to Episode 12 of Brave by Design on the future of work with Sir be law. Welcome to Brave by design. I'm your host, LL Oracle, Ill. I'm an entrepreneur, coach and speaker. I love thinking Bake. Exploring the power of personal development and sharing the best strategies from thought leaders and pioneers and business to empower ambitious women and allies to bravely rise and thrive. Let's get started. Hey, friends, it's me, Laura. Welcome to this episode of Brave by design. So as I've mentioned before, we're completely turning this ship around on the show to try and create more resources for y'all to thrive during this really unprecedented time. And so, for those of you who are new to the show Hi, Welcome. So great to have you here. I want to tell you a little bit about today's episode. I had a really great discussion with Serbia. Loll on the future of work. We talk about virtual space making as a way to connect and work as a way to network to re skill and even tow work with our kids. We talk about staying engaged with work at a distance and opportunities to use this time, and I want to talk a little bit about that before we dive in, because there are many of us who are facing job loss, layoffs or store closures. And I really empathize with you. Some of you know that I'm in a similar position as I make some big shifts in my own careers. I watch speaking engagements evaporate now. I don't want to diminish how scary this time may feel. So what I know to be true is that the greatest opportunities and innovation emerge out of the greatest crises. So here are some questions I'm asking myself. I'd encourage you to write these down, grab a journal, grab your phone, these air great ways to sort of begin a conversation with yourself about what opportunities are appearing for you. So here we go. Why is this sudden shift in your career the best thing that's ever happened? What doors is this opening for you? What new opportunities are emerging? Where do you want to dedicate your time? Focus on energy over the next few weeks as we go through this forced slow down. How will this allow you to break the confines of what you have quote unquote, always done or what you have gotten in a rut doing but don't enjoy anymore and move into what you are meant to. D'oh! I like to think a lot of this as the analogy of a caterpillar weaving its cocoon. What transformation will you emerge as refreshed and renewed this summer? So I encourage us all just to take a deep breath through that and lean into this pause. And when you're ready and you may be gone through some of those questions, start getting really excited about who you are becoming because of this. So I want to share with you some resources. First of all, every Wednesday in the brave by design Facebook Group I am going live in our zoom. You can get all the info over there. I'm going live from 11 32 12 30 Eastern. You can either just watch in the brave by design group, or you can grab the link to join me within the group on that zoom, and we're just gonna chat. It's a bring your own lunch. We're going to chat. We're going to see what's up. We're going to see how you're doing, and This is a great way to talk with people who are not your company, who you can network with people in different industries. And I can tell you what I know from the incredible people who do join. We have ah, very engaged and accomplished group who is listening to this show. And I find that incredibly exciting second thing I want you to know, as I just said, You know, I'm sort of watching a lot of my work shift dramatically and it's okay to take a pause. Guys, it's okay to say, Okay, I just need, like, like, a minute to process what's going on. And that's what I've done as I sort of took the last week and I was like a little discombobulated thinking about what the heck am I doing next to Where is this going? Home. I'm going to do this, and I realized that I have not shared with the world some of my greatest gifts around personal branding and personal marketing, and I've done those for companies. Some of you know that I worked for many years running my own consulting business, consulting with companies like G E Intel and Twitter on branding initiatives, and what I'm doing now is I'm bringing that to you guys. So I'm going to be launching a course very soon on how you can use personal branding, whether you just got your pink slip or you are thinking about using this time to make that career shift. And the great news is, you get to work with me. It'll kind of be like, sort of a lot of fun. So if you want more info on that head on over to Brave by design, sign up for the newsletter. That's where I'm going to start sharing this information without further ado. Let's get on to our episode with Serbia. Loll on the future of work Everyone, welcome to this episode of Brave by design. I am really excited because I think this might be the first episode where I have not only brought on an incredible woman, but someone who I also consider a friend. Sir Bilal is a facilitator, storyteller, speaker and consultant who is in the business of the future of work for individuals, teams and organizations to champions inclusive workplaces and uses empathy and strategy to create cultures where individuals and teams thrive survey is currently the chief impact officer at Luminary, a nationally recognized collaboration up dedicated to advancing women through community. She is an adjunct assistant professor at M. I use Robert F. Wagner Graduate School of Public Service, where she teaches courses that focus on management, leadership, workplace effectiveness and career development. Sir, be welcome to break by design. Thank
you. So excited to be here with you, Laura. And as you mentioned, we had met you think over a year ago you have had some amazing conversations. And so what a delight to do this with you and share with with a greater group.
Yeah. Thank you, sir. And one of the things I want to mention is I want to talk a little bit about how we met because we do not run in the same circles. In fact, we don't live in the same cities. And I want to tell a little bit about this story for people who are thinking about the power of connection, the power of building networks, the power of frankly, in my opinion, bringing women together. I was in New York quite frequently last year and I had heard of luminary which is this collaboration hub dedicated to helping women. And I felt I want to go see what that's about. Serbian. I met, we chatted and it was kind of like Okay, cool. Well, Lincoln, we'll stay in touch. And it's amazing how, when you build a connection like that, how things can just, you know, slowly develop and grow over time. So I just say to that to the audience, because we're gonna be talking about the future of work today. And I don't want anyone to underestimate the power of the people. You meet the power of the network, your building and the meaningfulness of every interaction that you go through day today because you just, um you really never know where things will lead you and that beautiful connection has led us here today. So certainly tell us a little bit more about the work that you do community and the future of work, cause I feel like those are all really interlinked in your work.
They really are. So I I approached the future of work in a number of ways. I am the chief impact officer, it luminary, where we're really looking at a community as a part of workplace, both in terms of bringing companies. Fortune 500 Fortune 100 companies, together with entrepreneurs with solo preneurs with people who are working remotely. Maybe they're the only person on their team in New York. So we're creating this ecosystem of mostly women across so many different industries who come to luminary and are able to connect with one another. So you can imagine that we have someone who maybe is it is a banker and sitting with an entrepreneur, And the doors of that opens for people someone who is an E e O. C. Lawyer, this sitting with a stylist and what that means for both of them. Maybe the stylist is going to get some business, and maybe the lawyer's gonna come to her work with a completely different profile. So that's one way in which that one, which I think about the future of work, the other way in which I think about the future of work, is as an educator. So I am, um, an adjunct professor at N. Y. U. I teach classes that run around management leadership, workplace effectiveness, and really, that's about advancing the next generation of managers and leaders into the workforce, particularly in public service. So these are people who are working in health care and in government, and I've been thinking about them a lot this last week, and I don't believe it because, well, some of us can work from home. These folks are working on overdrive because we put our trust in them to really take care of us as we move forward. Whether it be what? What decisions do people make about schools being open? Sanitation? Um, hospitals. What are the contingency plan should hospitals get full? And so these are the people I get to teach, and they're all people who want to change the world in this amazing way, um, and have incredible gifts, and we all need to know how to interact in the workplace. And lastly, I talked with so many people, entrepreneurs and others about what their personal individual future of work might look like. So where do they want to be? What are their values? What are their goals? And I do this a lot through a storytelling workshop that I do is well, you know, what are your goals? What are your skills and where do you think you want to be? And how can you help the people around you understand what it is that you want. But until you know what it is, it
little bit Get there. But then you can start helping other people understand. So s So I really do think about the future of work in a number of ways. Is it intersects with my daily life?
Well, you know, let's let's touch upon that point of interacting in the workplace. You mentioned how people could make almost his very serendipitous connections in the workplace like luminary because you've got all different kinds of people who are showing up in the same room. Of course, given what we're currently going through with Cove in 19 we're not interacting in those physical ways so much anymore. How can we strengthen or continue to build those interactions virtually and at a distance such a
good question and so so very timely as you talked about? So places like Luminary are looking at creating some virtual options and some virtual communities, and I think that will broaden the scope of what we're able to do, which is an amazing way to connect. We're you know, I think about what this would be like if we were 20 years ago, we wouldn't have zoom Wait, Then we wouldn't have all of these tools that allow us to do this more frequently. So what I've seen in my network is that people are saying, Listen, I'm gonna open up a zoom room. I'm gonna open up a chat room. Here's what I'm gonna hold space for. I might be holding space for somebody who wants to talk about their career. Maybe I'm just holding a virtual happy hour. Bring your cup of coffee and let's do that. And I think that some of that is on all of us to think about how we do that so we can open up the room. But then somebody also has to accept. So if you are not the organizer planner, but you see this going out in the world, maybe you show up so much of it is about showing up in those spaces and realizing that this is not a one week or two week phenomena, right? We're going to be in this for I think, longer than that. So if the first week you need to shore up yourself and your family or whatever it is that you wanted to. You could get your head in a space that this seals like something that you could d'oh! I think that's fine as well. So a lot of it and a lot about leadership is knowing yourself and knowing what works for you. And so I think, reaching out. I've read that, um, that there are some extensions to some of the Web browsers that you and your friend could watch a movie together. So you started at the same
sermon I've done that you have. I would it? Well, it's called Ah Net Flix Party. I want to say, Let me actually pull up my browser, I can tell. Yes, it's called a Netflix parties for chrome. It's free extension. It's really fun. You all have to have a Netflix account. You'll have to have chrome. You all have to download the Netflix party extension and then you watch someone controls the video and you can comment in The sidebar is things are happening. It's really fun. We did it for the first time yesterday. Um, we're going to do it again today. I'm doing it with friends. It's really cool, but I would love I mean just to your point. I have been running a virtual happy hour for the last three days, and I've been doing it primarily with friends. Um, and I want to say to folks who are listening to this, anyone can do this. You don't need to be of a certain title to do this. A certain level of experience. To do this, all you need to do is download zoom or another application that's free. Put out an announcement and you will. You'll be surprised who shows up. And so it really empowers any individual at any level or experience in the organization or whatever. Why not? Let's be in connection. Let's see what happens when we bring 5 10 15 people together again, who may not know each other, who may be in radically different parts of their careers, doing different things. And let's just talking connect as human beings. It is incredibly powerful. Have you done that yet?
I have not done that yet at what I would say to about that is sometimes the people who will enter into a zoom room are not the people who can enter in person. So I think about people who might be taking care of family, whether it be no older family or not, people who maybe don't have as much access to transportation just geographically what that opens. So if I was to have an in person gathering, whether it be a happy hour, some way to connect my friends were across the country or across the globe would not be able to attend exactly here they can into your point. We don't know what those connections are that might be made. And one of the things that that I was telling you this a little bit earlier is that I've also tried this, um, with my son, who's eight to do some virtual playdates. And so I think, for people who are working from home and are wondering, Okay, you're on technology for a call with your office states, and I've always called them with my son, my office friends. Your Children could also be doing that, And they I was really skeptical about summat first. So what did you do? So we did it with a friend who lives in Texas and really, it was two kids on an iPad showing each other their toys with a little bit strange because they can't directly build things together. But they were so happy. I've been so excited to do that, and I think that nowadays it's the power of connection, so we can be physically distant from one another, and we can still be close to one another. And and e think that in some ways we're so lucky to be in a time where zoom hangouts, what's up? Whatever technology home use exists that we can do that and that power of connection can still be stronger. And then I imagine what might happen to Laura if we take our example, you happen to be in New York. But what if you and I met in this virtual happy hour or this virtual conversation? Maybe it was around the future of work or how we work better. Who knows what could come of that the next time I'm in your city or that you're a miser and we would meet in person? So one of the classes that I teach and where Wagner is a class that is on a program that is mostly online. And what's so interesting is that the students come together, Uh, maybe 1/3 of the way through their program in person. And they already have these connections because they've been having classes together on a virtual platform where they can see one another. And that has been really interesting for me to see how that has worked and how they then interact in person. So I think what we've done in the past to Seo let's meet in person and then we keep in touch using virtual, I think now the script for that might he flipped just as more Yeah, as more and more people, our self quarantine eight to the betterment of our public health. Overall, that we can still find ways to connect with one another.
Sir B. I hear two things in what you're saying, Um, that are really popping out to me. The first is I hear you talking a lot about sort of some of the benefits or gifts in the challenge that we're currently faced with, and I I love that you have that attitude and I would love for you to talk a little bit more about that The second thing I hear you talking about is the value of, um, face to face, so to speak, communication that there is potentially a difference between just picking up the phone and talking to someone versus I actually get to look atyou. We get to look each other in the eye, even through a camera lens, and we get to connect on how profound that is and how meaningful that could be. Above and beyond. Just getting on the phone with someone.
That's right. So so in the first point, I'm an internal optimist. I think that we need to be both realistic and optimistic. And part of that optimism is around connection and certainly is somebody who is a connector by nature, feeling like we can connect even in this time. And really, maybe especially in this time is important. It's important for all of us to think about what that's gonna look like. So that is my my half glass full always sort of optimistic attitude, and we have these incredible gifts of technology and maybe it means that all of us will learn how to use them better, and I do think for the future of work. It may mean that a lot of people will be more open to things like working from home or flexible work policies. And so, for the last year, I have, um you know, on and off at least one day a week, work from home and found it to be a phenomenal thing. And I also know, having talked to many people that some workplaces, more than others are open to it and some are not. And for those that are not, we're now all forced into understanding how it could work for us and what that might open up in terms of teens in terms of organizations, in terms of who we hire, how we hire them, what that workplace looks like. I just I don't think I don't think we even know what that's gonna look like. But I do think we're at a time where some of that will open up doors for people that were previously closed. So I think that piece of it is really exciting when we think about the future of work and knowing that we can still stay connected and that maybe there are these hybrid models. So we are maybe a remote team. But three times a year we get together in person. And what does that look like? So I think, you know, as we look to the future of work, a lot of this will become more and more part of our daily life. But things that we never thought to be virtual, we're now all forced to figure out how that is virtual, which I think it's fantastic. It's
a huge opportunity for growth. I've heard a lot of people saying, You know, what I see in the future of work is more like use more remote work because people are going to figure this out and say it actually doesn't really matter too much if I'm in a room with you or not, Um, and and I want to say to your point about companies that are very resistant to having employees who could work from home, not work from home and are now forced. That brings up a couple interesting things for me, and the first thing I think about is where is the level of trust with you and your employees around? Is it that you don't trust them? Um, and second of all. If you are concerned about your employees sitting at home in their pajamas watching Netflix for eight hours a day instead of working, I want to ask those companies, What are you doing to not engage your staff, to not engage your employees, to not give them a sense of ownership and meaningfulness in the work instead of putting it on the employees? Why don't you? Let's make that self reflective. What about this is disengaging. We already know from the research that 70% of employees air disengaged globally. Why do you think that is? There is so much research to show some of the possible causes of that. So really, look back at yourself. This is a great time for, um, internal reflection, and I want to move their next when we talk about okay, it's probably gonna be longer than a couple of weeks. I mean, this will be a funny episode to listen back to survey. Well, you know, either is gonna age really Well, it's gonna age terribly in terms of it will be like we were back to work in six months.
We'll have to do at a follower. We'll
do a follow up. Yeah, well, do fall. But, um, for people who may, let's say, be faced with a couple months of rials shift and change. I want you to talk about how those individuals, apart from their work day, how can we best map out what we want for our careers? Um, when we have this extra time to reflect, Listen, everyone, we don't have commuting time anymore. We have our work day, and then we set it with family. We're not running around. Two events were not running around to do anything. I think this is an incredible time for self reflection around. Where do I want to go next in my career. And I love to ask you for your advice around that and what you would recommend for individuals thinking about that.
Absolutely. So before we jump to the individual, I do also want to say that we know that people are disengaged. Gallup has also shown that people who work 2 to 3 days a week from home or some of your happiest and most productive workers And so the idea of where we were thinking about going might be more of that. And I do think in general around the trust issue. Everybody should be having conversations about what does work from home look like for you. So you were You know, does that mean for you that you have some things you need to do in the middle of the day? And what does that look like? Is that or is that not possible? In some jobs, that might not be possible because you need to be responding to things that certain times. And so I think having some of those conversations so that there is some transparency around Here's what I need. Here's what you need. Okay, let's talk about how that might work for us. Is good management. And
it was a good
management, whether you're working from home or whether you're working in person. It is good management to have a conversation with your employees, set some expectations, and for the employees to say, Here are the things that are working for me, and so that might bring us to this individual points. I think this may be a time that a lot of people also think, Oh my goodness, this thing is going on in the world and I might die and I don't mean to be dramatic about it, but we do know that some people have many people have already already passed away and some b and we don't know how it what those numbers are gonna look like. And so I do think there is some sense of people thinking Am I doing what I want to be doing with my life? Should I be thinking about what's next? This is not how I want to be spending my day or for other people. They might think This is amazing. I am doing exactly what I want to do. So I want it. Oh, I like that. Underscore this idea that we're in a context where people are going to be thinking about their career because we don't know what tomorrow brings. We don't know what six months from now is gonna bring. We don't know what this whole new world is going to look like because we just don't have those answers. But I do think it causes many people to think about I Am I happy with my with my career? Am I happy with my job getting what I want to get out of it And so I think there will be a lot of self reflection. And for me, a lot of that sometimes comes down to What are my values? Am I living my values and my money? Are my skills being used? Well, am I feeling respected, So trusted? Respected. Um, and those are questions making people will start asking themselves. And for people who is answers are not so great. Those were the people who are gonna be tempted to be watching Netflix during the day. And some of that is a conversation with yourself as well as with your employer. Right. So is this something I want to be doing? Okay. Now that this has shifted, what might it look like? I think the other reality is many people are gonna find themselves out of work. True. Full stop. Right. The economy. Um, small businesses, they're struggling right now. Restaurants people are gonna find themselves out of work. So the same questions are what you know, which way value where my skills Where my what What what context to do I want to work in. What does a good work environment look like for me? Are all questions that can really help guide what's next. Understanding that sometimes the answer is I just need to be employed right now because I need that bottom line paycheck. But these air still questions that people can have in their head about
What is it that they want to be doing? Yeah. And for into your 0.4 people who are facing unemployment right now, this is a great time to think about Re Skilling. It's a little thing you need. It is a wonderful time too. By the way, I just want to say to Folks were listening If you're not on Lincoln, get your cell phone. Lincoln. Right now, this is not the community. It was five, even 10 years ago. It's very different and how you may remember it. There are tons of free resources, tons of communities. I have seen a kn outpouring of offerings for people offering Webinars on free advice, free job re Skilling, productivity management, all that kind of stuff. There's so much going on there, really recommend you get on there and start getting active by commenting on people's posts by connecting with people, seeing what the possibilities are for your life that are really open up those windows for you. But yeah, it's a great time to re skill. It's a great time to think about where do I want to go? What really matters? You know, we're just as you said, we're all faced kind of with this existential question right now, off. What is my life about? What is it and
what's important to me? What's that? What matters? Yeah, absolutely. So the point about re Skilling and upscaling Ah, 100%. You know, even for people who say All right, I have this extra our cause. I'm not commuting. What can I do in that? Ah, lot of a lot of colleges and universities who used, um, kind of these online platforms have classes up. So you could take classes by the most most popular professors at some top universities. Either for curiosity or for up Skilling and Re Skilling. You could e do think that there are lots of people who are making platforms free that are usually not free around tow learning, which is incredible and thinking about how might you use technology the same way you might think about watching a movie with a friend? Maybe the two of you have a goal together and have an accountability partner. So I would say to you, Laura Okay. You know, you just have started. This podcast has just been amazing and doing so well. And maybe there's a skill that you want to learn, um, related to podcasting. And maybe there's a skill that I want to learn related to making better online classes even though I've been doing that. But I think you can always get better at your craft, and maybe we hold each other accountable. Maybe. I say, Okay, every week, we're going to check in and you're gonna tell me three things you learned, and I'm gonna tell you three things I learned so it could also make that fun. And I learned that, you know? So whether it's I want to get a little bit better, like for me, Actually, one of the things is I want to figure out a program where I could do some very easy graphic design, and I have a couple that I'm looking at, but this gives me some time to play with them a little bit and see which one I really like the best, and that is because I have a little bit You know, I don't have that commute time. I don't have that open. And for other people, it may not be up Skilling re skilling it. Maybe I just wanna hold the people in my life a little closer
or I want
to write or I want to paint. I want to draw. You know, what are some of those things that you have always wanted to do? I want to try out this new yield and struck stur who's online. I want to try out something. And and I think there are things that we can do even in the fitness space where people have made some of those online classes free. So e think we can do a lot of ups killing and re Skilling, all of which are gonna have benefits to our lives and our future of work
And two is to your point in different areas of our life. This doesn't necessarily have to be about career, correct? It could be What is that thing I've wanted to do? And now I can finally do it now. I actually have the time to do it. Um, I I It's funny, Um, I think a lot about meditation and mindfulness. E Think a lot about people who talk about Oh, I I should get into that or figure what that's about. Guys, there's not a better time. It's a better time than a time when we're sort of in a little bit of a ah sort of crisis, so to speak, to learn how to ground yourself to learn how to center. It's a beautiful way to start your day. Um, we haven't talked much about that on the show, but again, it's one of those skills, simple things and the thing I like about what you're talking about. Serving is thes heir, not you talked about, um, learning some of the design tools because you're curious about that. And I like that example because it's not like you're saying you know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna go get a PhD in the next two months. You're saying because people think really big. Sometimes they think way too big, and they get overwhelmed, and then they shut down. And what I love about your example is that is something that is simple, that you can do in a month or two. That is easy. That is not going to overtax you and overburden you, and it has a really tangible outcome. It's kind of like as we talked about smart goals. It's very smart type of goal that's very reachable. So think about that, too. Folks, when you're listening, it doesn't have to be like I'm going to take on the next great American novel. It could be like, Hey, you know what? I just want to write 20 minutes a day and when you think
and I think for some people they're not gonna feel like they have the time because we have kids. We're gonna be home assurance from school, and we need to think about how are we keeping them occupied? What's happening? Are they getting? Are they getting education through online portal through their school system, which a lot of people are moving towards? Is it workbooks? But But that is also an opportunity, right? It's an opportunity to see how we teach what is what is our threshold for patients? Uh, when we teach and that is that is actually a very important professional skills, yes, but I would also say to you um, you know, I have, since my son has been born, read to him on a regular basis, and one of the things it's done is made me a much better public speaker because I am in effect when I read to him speaking, and I want to make feeing the dialogue feel alive, and I want to make the dialogue feel exciting. And so then when you were out public speaking in a meeting in Ah, um, in a presentation, you can take some of those skills because it has, for me increased my fluency of feeling good about that and several good food. It is an up skill that is also a really strong personal benefits. I e also want to be subtle about the people who are saying now I have much more to balance than I did before and thinking about How are some of those things also applicable in a professional setting?
Yep, What? I love that, and that's a great point. One of the things I told all my clients and I'll share it here for those listening is how is what's happening of greatest benefit to my highest values. So a lot of times we get into a city a state of, um in gratitude because we can't see how what's happening is actually serving us. And so to your point, how is the things that you are now having to do? How will they serve you in the future? How What are those transferable skills that you'll be able to use and public speaking? Oh my gosh, what an incredible one! Because most people are absolutely terrified of it. Most people are absolutely overwhelmed by doing lesson planning by organizing structuring courses like that. I feel that this could really Harold in some amazing work opportunities for individuals down the road. But, guys, it's how you choose to see the situation right. Serbia and I are clearly optimists clearly so, but it's the choice is yours. It's your perception. You can do what you want with it. You can spend this time as you like, and we're here to support you, sir, Be before this has just flown by. It's been so much fun. I love for you to share. Do you have a couple takeaways for the audience?
I do. So one is is thinking about what you need. What do you need in this moment, and if it is, I need a day. I think it is on us as employees to to say Timeout. I need a day. I need 1/2 a day. I just need to get my head around this new reality in which I'm living and hopefully the people who support us at work, We'll say, Got it. We're all there And here's what I need from you. You know I can give you this. I can give you that. And here's where I need you to step in. So I think definitely understanding where we are. So that's about taking that minute. THIO ASSESS What's going on? What do we need Making a plan for? How you want to spend some of this time and explore these new remote technology is whether it is upscaling re Skilling holding that virtual happy hour getting in touch with your college classmate that you have not talked to in ages, and now you might be able to at so whatever that is for you. I think that is important. I really do think to it gives us all an opportunity to re evaluate what is important to us, and we can all make a difference. I think that part feels really clear from your virtual happy hours and other what? What we're seeing around this kindness. And if you're not ready to take advantage of it this week, there's always next week.
Exactly. We'll be here. That's right. I'm not going anywhere. Not going anywhere. Sorry. I love that. Thank you so much for joining us. And how can individuals reach you outside of this podcast?
Absolutely. So I'm on lengthen. Um, that is probably the put that is my social class for my most active. And then after that, instagram, which is S l cool ABB Ventures, which will be. And then, um, I have a website which has some information on it as well, which is www dot serving well dot com. Really information about work that I've done and things that are important to me. And I look forward to tonight with more people.
I love it. Well, thank you so much for joining us on this episode of brave fight design. Absolutely. Thank you so much. I want to thank you for joining me and remember to subscribe to your favorite app. So you can stay up to date and I would love your review. If you've enjoyed this episode, please leave a review and comment on apple podcasts. You can also keep in touch with me online. You confine me on Lincoln and I'm also on instagram at force of bad ass. Or all that information will be available in the show notes until next time. Stay brave.